The signage I have created to display on my parcels through out Second Life. I pay tier for nearly three years in Bear Sim (since it came online in 2005) and I have very limited access to the sim because of a group known as 'Bear Buddies' squatting in the InfoHub up to ten hours a day.Saturday, September 22, 2007
InfoHub Loitering and Greifing reaching a High Point
HISTORY: Bear sim came online early 2005. The Realtor who won it at auction had me buy a piece. No roads and no Telehub for months as I built my shopping area. Then it came and traffic was steady and good for business.
2006: Telehubs become obsolete. Direct teleport is in full effect and the telehubs are decommissioned. Some areas are sold as regular real estate, some are preserved as Linden land. The Lindens ask property owners in the sims that have defunct Telehub lands if they would like a community builder to build a structure where the Telehub was. It was explained that these InfoHUBS would have notegivers for new players to receive information about Second Life. Seemed friendly enough - so we say yes as opposed to having the land sold off and chopped up (some Telehubs were completely wiped away and the land sold). By this time I own most of Bear sim, nearly a quarter of Sawdell and a few thousand meters of land in Gealain. I had spent alot of time and money preserving Bear sim and the surrounding sims. I bought out Vampire clubs, grabbed roadside parcels across the sim line to make sure advertising did not spring up there and was lucky enough to be a good judge of character when selling land. Only one adfarmer spot in Bear sim and that has been contained for the moment. I got a island and sold off most of Bear to one fellow that took care it for nearly a year. I kept one roadside parcel so when folks came looking for me they could find a re-directed teleporter.
Then open enrollment hit the grid and Linden Lab had to re-direct the traffic coming in - so they used these defunct Telehub spots that to drop these people. The day of the Brazilian invasion I could not enter Bear sim because of all of the new player traffic being directed there. After a conversation with the Lindens this was rectified.
AND NOW: Free accounts meant that the people that liked to go to sandboxes to socialize had to find safer places to gather and chat. The griefing in Sandboxes was and still is a major problem (in today's SL Forum: "I was in a sandbox tonight and suddenly my avatar became grotesquely distorted. Then a message appeared on the chat line that said something to the effect of "Trasher says do you like your new shape Yipp Oh?""). So these social chatters made their way to what is now considered InfoHUBS. Then Linden Lab decided to test the voice client on the mainland before releasing it grid-wide. They told everyone to go to these InfoHUBS and try the voice client. And thousands complied.
THE PROBLEM: Many of these people that ended up chatting for hours in these areas were crude, rude and greifing. People would gather to be entertained by these public nuisances. After voice was released grid-wide on everyone's parcel - There had emerged a community of people that re-defined the InfoHUB. Even Linden Lab employees re-defined the infoHUB
Jesse Linden had wrote:
"Recently we set aside a number of spaces in Second Life to serve as community and information centers for our resident population.
Our goal in this follows a historical model of a town center or community square as a location in which to build spaces for social interaction and information exchange. These spaces, called Infohubs in Second Life, are distributed throughout the mainland grid. Because these spaces vary in size from very small plots of land to larger ones, we are considering two types of builds. The smaller of these would function as an information center for centralized distribution of
The Bear InfoHub is considered a smaller Hub and therefore functions as an information center for centralized distribution of Linden Lab news and announcements as well as resident content. Bear sim only holds 43 avatars and begins to have major lag issues after 30 are present for more than two hours.
Just yesterday I had to have a student leave the sim to get another into the classroom BECAUSE THERE WERE 38 PEOPLE IN TH EBEAR INFOHUB.
I have tracked the new player traffic and the traffic of the people that loiter in the hub and use it for conversation, some griefing and other hi-jinks. When the group of chatters that have formed a group (Bear Buddies) are not in the InfoHUB we have a regula flow of new players rezzing into the Hub, getting their bearings and then moving on to explore and start their Second Life. When the Bear Buddies insist upon sitting in the Hub for upwards to 10 hours a day - the traffic comes in but does not cycle out as quickly. A glut of people in that one area begins to form that completely overpowers the entire sim (think of casino camping). And, at least twice a week, then the griefers come.
This InfoHUB is for distribution of information - not a social area for chatters and those seeking negative attention. As a tier paying land owner in Bear sim - I have the right to utilize the resources that I have been paying for for over two years. But these Bear Buddies believe that since they decided to sit there - they have the right to utlize over 85% of the sim's resources.
Some quotes from Bear Buddy Members:
Katie Broome: our plan is to stop this fighting, and get the B to move on
Clint Peccable: i would rather stand around and loiter..oh and skate
Clint Peccable: funny he has a place not far from here and doesnt come to Bear bithcin about people being here.
This group has dug in deep and refuses to budge. They say the have some Linden endorsement that they are allowed to sit there as long as they want. They also say that the Linden they spoke to said the Hub will stay as it. As a landowner who has the right to use the resources I am paying for I challenge that. I am currently collecting sim data, taking screen shots and tracking the glut of loiterers that takeover the sim daily. This information will be presented to Linden Lab by the end of this month. I do expect that Linden Lab will respond as they did before and take action to make sure that people with vested interest in a server can access it freely.
InfoHub Loitering and Greifing reaching a High Point
Norf Lundquist
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 37 InfoHUBS - Which is the BEST?
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Hi,
As a relative Newbie I found Bear InfoHUB (Bear 31,131,111) to be one of the better InfoHUBs for information, voicechat and general help. I think this is down to it being a non-scripted & non-rez area. Most of the others, I tend to spend most of my time defending against spammers and Greifers!
Which InfoHUBS do YOU recommend?
Kind Regards
Norf Lundquist
09-17-2007, 03:41 PM
#3
Groit Straaf
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 3 Bear Infohub
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Bear has been an excellent place for me to find acceptance. It seems like Bear's the only place that refreshes it's population so quickly... which is perfect for developing new friendships- as opposed to other social places that die down relatively quickly. Also, being at Bear sure beats wandering around aimlessly, running into people that don't even want you there most of the time.
Nicki Boucher
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 2 Which Info Hub do you like best?
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I also agree with your choice of Bear Info Hub. As a newbie, I was dropped into Bear Info Hub. People were very kind and helpful, and after visiting several other hubs, this is my "hub" of choice. No one even spoke to me at the others I visited. This is "home".
bladyblue Bommerang
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 597 Bear is a lovely Hub - but there aren't many of those 'touch to get info'
This post is a group-effort from those idle people that stand in Bear Hub to create a glut of people there so the 43 person in the mainland sim limit can be reached and I can no longer use my parcel because I will not be able to enter the sim (notice the group tag they all have - Bear Buddies). Very sad. They are not happy to have 23 to 30 people standing in the Hub all day. They want the entire sim to focus on their base chat sessions. As I said most have land elsewhere and would not appreciate it if they could not access their land because of harassment.
I am a mentor and instructor. I have my school in Bear sim on my land I have there. I usually only need to have room for ten people at one time to have my classes. These Hub chatters tell me I am being selfish because I wish to use my land I have been paying for for two years. I have been assulted with racist texture spam on my parcel also today [url]http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e298/bladyblue/racism_001.jpg[/url] - the same day they started this 'come to Bear Sim and Chat' campaign.
InfoHubs are a great idea - for new players to come and get information and to have a place to set home. But I do not agree that 43 people should be allowed to stand in a InfoHub and block landowners and their customers from entering the land they pay for.
BluesSweet Tomorrow
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 3
Well if i remember right, The one that is complaining about us at bear being idle chatters also stood in Bear for almost 3 hours talking away to everyone. Bear is home to many of us. Even those of us that have homes in other places. I know many of us help the newbies that arrive by giving landmarks and clothing and helpful hints on how to get around SL. If you go to other infohubs you will also find ppl sitting/standing around chatting!! Just not as friendly as us at bear are tho. The no rezz/build is great also. So Bear gets my vote on being the friendliest infohub!!
bladyblue Bommerang
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 597 Quote:
Originally Posted by BluesSweet Tomorrow
The one that is complaining about us at bear being idle chatters also stood in Bear for almost 3 hours talking away to everyone.
Another Bear Buddie member heard from. Since I pay tier in the Sim I am expected to be here for hours.
______________________________________________________________________
Norf Lundquist
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 37
___________________________________________________________________
Glad you like Bear as well - but the question was which other InfoHUB do you recommend. Personal vendettas are best left unwritten and unspoken.
Also threats and insinuations are best left out of SL - as a
Kind Regards
Norf Lundquist.
Groit Straaf
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 3 I could be mistaken, Norf, but you didn't say "other"
Norf Lundquist
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 37
________________________________________
Maybe a coloquialism on my part - I just want to find out what people think (other people!) is the best InfoHUB (other InfoHUB!) is...
Regards
Norf
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bladyblue Bommerang
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 597 Quote:
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
Glad you like Bear as well - but the question was which other InfoHUB do you recommend.
Read what I wrote Norf. I said that the INFOHUBS are for information - not what you all use it for. I would not post here and tell anyone that sees this post to go and hang around in a sim that only holds 43 people. Especially since there are already up towarss 30 people standing around in the INFOHUB for hours on end.
Quote:
Personal vendettas are best left unwritten and unspoken.
Then there was no reason to start this thread in the first place.
__________________
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Last edited by bladyblue Bommerang : 09-17-2007 at 09:22 PM.
Norf Lundquist
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 37 [QUOTE=Read what I wrote Norf. I said that the INFOHUBS are for information - not what you all use it for.]
I did read closely, and because there isnt such information in Bear InfoHUB we do actually help out where we can. Its where I and many others got help when we started - personally I'm returning the favour. Bear is a social place to meet up with friends, chew the fat and have some fun. we also, as mentioned help out people that are "born" to Bear as its rare that a
I have not asked people to "hang around" in bear for hours on end - I asked which InfoHUB people considered the BEST - its a social thing, getting feedback from a reasonable question.
So the question still stands
Kind Regards
Norf
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bladyblue Bommerang
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 597 Quote:
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
Bear is a social place to meet up with friends, chew the fat and have some fun.
The Bear INFOHUB was not placed there for that reason. ELBOW ROOM, The Blarney Stone etc. are fully voice enabled for voice chat.
Quote:
I have not asked people to "hang around" in bear for hours on end - I asked which InfoHUB people considered the BEST - its a social thing, getting feedback from a reasonable question.
The Best InfoHUB should be judged on INFORMATION that the hub provides. Bear InfoHub has one free texture vendor and one information card giver. Not the highest level of information there. I believe that any of the new public
Cam
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 7 Hehe. Well for me the best source of information has always been from others that have helped me. I was born at Bear and found most of my friends at the Infohub This was also the place where i was helped by the regulars. Because of this I now try to return the favour wherever possible and some of the regulars that use bear now were newbies that I helped myself. I found helpful people much better for "info" than any sign. I guess that for "info" the bear infohub would qualify as one of the best.
It's a shame that one of the posters here seem to be openly discouraging the use of the Bear infohub simply because of business reasons .....After all the main point of Second life for many is to socialise and unwind after work.
Bladyblue I find it sad that you call bear a "chat ghetto" it's also sad that you call the people who frequent the infohub "loiterers" For me this is demeaning to the people who use the hub. In several conversations you have made it very clear that if the numbers increase at bear you would be happy to go to the Lindens to see about getting it closed.....Would it not be more gracious to just relocate to a sim where no infohub exists?
I find it strange that you call the people at bear "griefers" This would be slightly difficult bearing in mind that the infohub is no build, no script, no anything? If you want to see greifing try one or two of the hubs where these things are enabled!
If you eventually get your way and have the Infohub closed, would this be fair on the other shop owners who rely on the traffic from the hub for business?
Finally.......Is 43 the correct figure for the maximum players in a sim?
Bladyblue Bommerang
Now we hear from the founder of the Bear Buddies group.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam
It's a shame that one of the posters here seem to be openly discouraging the use of the Bear infohub simply because of business reasons .....After all the main point of Second life for many is to socialise and unwind after work.
And the main point of SL for many is to use the parcel they pay real money for to do what they please on it. Having people who own land in another sim knowingling block access to land owners is wrong and unneccessary.
Voice was first enabled in info hubs while Sl rolled it out across the grid. They surely did not mean for you to stay there all the times after you had it on your parcel. INFOHUB is not CHAT HUB. If Lindens endorsed free chat zones then people would not buy their own parcels.
Quote:
Bladyblue I find it sad that you call bear a "chat ghetto"
Conversation is usually about sex acts, insults being thrown about or someone looking for negative attention.
Quote:
it's also sad that you call the people who frequent the infohub "loiterers" For me this is demeaning to the people who use the hub.
If I stand in front of the 7-11 for 5 hours talking to my friends I am a loiterer. What is the difference from what you are doing? At twenty to 30 people standing around there for five hours it is not tooo much of a inconvienience. But when there is a campaign started to have each 'regular' bring two people to fill the sim and deny land owners access - Something needs to be said.
Quote:
Would it not be more gracious to just relocate to a sim where no infohub exists?
Why you endorse people that do not pay tier in a sim to take it over and have someone that has been paying tier there for nearly three years to move and have to re-establish the business (because all of the landmarks that have been dostributed would be useless) is beyond me.
Quote:
If you eventually get your way and have the Infohub closed, would this be fair on the other shop owners who rely on the traffic from the hub for business?
When LL closed the Telehubs we had to use CLASSIFIEDS to advertise our business. As I do now. As every busness does now. There is no reason to even discuss the hub as long as it stays at 20 to 30 people at a time there. But if the people there feel they have the right to start a campaign to increase the hub loitering traffic so Land owners cannot eneter the sim - then I would definitely ask for Linden Lab assistance for the problem.
Cam
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 7 1) There has NEVER EVER been any campaign for any reason against anybody. No one is, has, or will (to the best of my knowledge) blocked access to anyone!! This is simply nonsense.
2)Who is to say what was intended in any given area? If people like the infohub and wish to socialise and help the newcomers......good luck to them. People will still buy their own parcels if they choose to socialise at the infohub or not, I can speak first hand for that since I do own land.
3) The infohub is a mature area where a plethora of different subjects are talked about. Are you suggesting that Second Life introduce a list of what may and may not be talked about? If the subjects are not to your liking then it may be an idea for you to chat about what interests you? But then ......... would that make you a "loiterer" too?
4) You say that there is a campaign whereby each regular will bring two more people to fill the sim?!!!! LOL To this point i am completely bemused. I mean....why?
5) I still stand by the fact that I find it very sad that you choose to come to the infohub and call people loiterers! People that spend a lot of time helping the newcomers to get a feel for the place and to become established in second life. Its a fact that people would rather talk to real people than they would talk to an automated message or click a sign with limited content. The very best info is found by chatting to another resident and being introduced to others that can help. It's called social networking and has huge benefits.
6) I'm wondering what would become of Second Life if business owners are allowed to push and shove residents to areas that are less inconveinient to them.
7) It's interesting to note that you didn't coment on the fact that most businesses are reliant on the traffic from infohubs? If you manage to close Bear infohub what about the businesses that DO rely on this traffic? Not only are you being unfair to the residents that use it but you are also being unfair to those other businesses. (imho)
Bladyblue Bommerang
So after all these posts by the same people in the same group it becomes quite obvious there is history here. Alot of effort to bring people to a InfoHub that is meant for new players to get INFORMATION and not a rowdy chat zone for a bored group of people that want to talk loudly and play mild greifing games on each other. They had a good time tonight luring a new player to a script enabled area so they could try out the gun they made.
Leilani Charlotte
Originally Posted by bladyblue Bommerang
So after all these posts by the same people in the same group it becomes quite obvious there is history here. Alot of effort to bring people to a InfoHub that is meant for new players to get INFORMATION and not a rowdy chat zone for a bored group of people that want to talk loudly and play mild greifing games on each other. They had a good time tonight luring a new player to a script enabled area so they could try out the gun they made.
I have to disagree with the 'Bored' bit...we dont get time to be bored...we're having too much fun!!!!!!
(Especially shooting people with that gun)!!!
KIDDING .........................KIDDING..........ONLY Kidding............people here are fun.......have fun.............and help Newbies............at the same time.
(After we shoot ......them...............of course)!
Cam
Originally Posted by bladyblue Bommerang
So after all these posts by the same people in the same group it becomes quite obvious there is history here. Alot of effort to bring people to a InfoHub that is meant for new players to get INFORMATION and not a rowdy chat zone for a bored group of people that want to talk loudly and play mild greifing games on each other. They had a good time tonight luring a new player to a script enabled area so they could try out the gun they made.
What is obvious here is your apparent contept for the people that come to the Bear Infohub to socialise perhaps if you embraced the good people that use this infohub instead of talking down to them you may find that it is in fact "fun".....Isn't this the aim of SL? Or is the aim to just be here to make money?
I'm also not bored........thanks to the infohub once again. Yes it's true there is "history" the "history" is that we all care for our community a very great deal. Its a shame that having a good time has been interpreted by you to mean "griefing" Perhaps a little less time worrying about how much money is being made and a little more time getting to know and appreciate the people at the infohub may chage your outlook on the "loiterers"?
I noticed also that once again my question was skillfully avoided..........My question once again was......Do you think it is fair that one person should control the traffic of a whole sim and also the infohub?
Bladyblue Bommerang
Originally Posted by Cam
Do you think it is fair that one person should control the traffic of a whole sim and also the infohub?
No it is not fair that
Norf Lundquist
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 37
________________________________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by bladyblue Bommerang
No it is not fair that
Cams group is NOT controlling anything - the group does not encourage anything that people dont want to do. Its a social group to exchange ideas / help - feel free to join in either ID you use.
Now lets get back on topic, which InfoHub do you recommend ?
Regards
Norf
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bladyblue Bommerang
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 597
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
Cams group is NOT controlling anything - the group does not encourage anything that people dont want to do.
I know it ssomething you all decided you wanted to do. That's the issue. A bunch of non-tier paying people (organized into a group) clogging up a sim out of spite is a issue.
Quote:
Now lets get back on topic, which InfoHub do you recommend ?
Chatting for 5 hours is not something to base the usefullness of a INFOHUB on. The new public
The Bear Buddies shooting new players is not helpful at all.
_____________________________________________________________
Norf Lundquist
Quote:
Now lets get back on topic, which InfoHub do you recommend ?
Chatting for 5 hours is not something to base the usefullness of a INFOHUB on. The new public
The Bear Buddies shooting new players is not helpful at all.
Well if you feel that
Now please if you have a gripe, take it up with Linden Labs. Venting here may make you feel better but its not very constructive.
Regards
Norf
Bladyblue Bommerang
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
Well if you feel that
Now please if you have a gripe, take it up with
You asked a question and I answered it (since no one else did). Your group used this thread to go off topic and move forward with their plan to attract a glut of people to the Bear InfoHub. I merely pointed out that Tier paying land owners in Bear need to have access to their land also.
Norf Lundquist
[QUOTE= You asked a question and I answered it]
did you ?
[QUOTE= Your group used this thread to go off topic and move forward with their plan to attract a glut of people to the Bear InfoHub.]
if you think a post asking what InfoHUB is BEST (in their opinion) is going to attract a glut of people to Bear, maybe you should hire me as mareketeer for your business as it seems that your business is suffering?
If there is anything we as a group can do to help, please let us know
Regards
Norf 
Bladyblue Bommerang
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
if you think a post asking what InfoHUB is BEST (in their opinion) is going to attract a glut of people to Bear, maybe you should hire me as mareketeer for your business as it seems that your business is suffering? If there is anything we as a group can do to help, please let us know
The post was a vieled attempt to start off the campaign to fill the infoHub your group talked about. Not that vieled though - since you posted and THE NEXT SIX POSTS WERE FROM YOUR GROUP MEMBERS PROMOTING ONLY BEAR HUB. This entire thread isn't in any way clever at all.
My business in Bear sim is a school for people to learn DJing using shoutcast into Second Life, Host training and Venue Owner/Manager training. I developed the school to support my own needs for staff - but since other future club owners and campers looking for a better way started seeking the classes also I opened it up to everyone. I started the school at two days a week and now it is 4 days week because of all of the interest. So, no thanks, I do not need the marketing assistance of a guy sitting on a public wall.
Norf Lundquist
Quote:
Originally Posted by bladyblue Bommerang
The post was a vieled attempt to start off the campaign to fill the infoHub your group talked about. Not that vieled though - since you posted and THE NEXT SIX POSTS WERE FROM YOUR GROUP MEMBERS PROMOTING ONLY BEAR HUB. This entire thread isn't in any way clever at all.
My business in Bear sim is a school for people to learn DJing using shoutcast into Second Life, Host training and Venue Owner/Manager training. I developed the school to support my own needs for staff - but since other future club owners and campers looking for a better way started seeking the classes also I opened it up to everyone. I started the school at two days a week and now it is 4 days week because of all of the interest. So, no thanks, I do not need the marketing assistance of a guy sitting on a public wall.
So your business is not being affected, in fact its increasing which negates your whole argument that the Bear InfoHUB is harming you - Thank You for the clarification.
yes I'm sitting on a public wall (as you put it) in Bear InfoHUB helping people. not griping about non-issues.
Now please, take your argument to someone that takes notice, your anatagonistic attitude and avoidance of answering against reasoned questions is tiresome.
Regards
Norf
PS - Publicly accusing people of greifing and racism, especially the wrong people will not improve your standing. This thread alone has demonstrated that you argue for arguments sake .
Bladyblue Bommerang
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
So your business is not being affected, in fact its increasing which negates your whole argument that the Bear InfoHUB is harming you - Thank You for the clarification.
If I sit on my hands and allow you all to move forward with your plan to bring in 43 people to the InfoHub to stop me from entering the sim I pay tier in then I would be allowing you all to use the Hub to harm me.
Quote:
yes I'm sitting on a public wall (as you put it) in Bear InfoHUB helping people. not griping about non-issues.
As you write this I am standing right next to you. You are not helping anyone.
Quote:
Now please, take your argument to someone that takes notice, your anatagonistic attitude and avoidance of answering against reasoned questions is tiresome.
As I pointed out, Argent and I are the only ones that did answer your question. The other posts are from your group members trying to promote Bear to cause a glut of activity in the InfoHub.
Quote:
PS - Publicly accusing people of greifing and racism, especially the wrong people will not improve your standing. This thread alone has demonstrated that you argue for arguments sake .
The wrong people - That's a laugh. I do not need standing with any of you - so no worries about that. I argue to be able to keep the land I have had for nearly 3 years. That may mean nothing to someone that has been in SL for two months - but some of us residents like to keep their mainland parcels accessible and free of greifers.
Norf Lundquist
There's nobody about yet we are supposed to be promoting bear - another one of your accusations shot down in flames. How foolish can one person look in so few posts.
As you have said to me in Bear in your other ID as Lias Leandros, "Thank you for the advertising" - well yes, any advertising is Good advertising. You're very welcome, it wasn't intentional to promote anything (in fact if you re-read AGAIN the original thread starter you will see that it was an open question to which InfoHUB people regard as best, whether that be Bear or any other number of InfoHUBS)
Maybe if you put as much effort into the social side of SL, instead of using threads like this to promote business, you'll see that there is another side.
So, i missed it - which InfoHUB did you say was best ? maybe as an alternative to Bear ?
Regards
Norf
Bladyblue Bommerang
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
So, i missed it - which InfoHUB did you say was best ? maybe as an alternative to Bear ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
Well if you feel that
Try to keep up.
Quote:
it wasn't intentional to promote anything (in fact if you re-read AGAIN the original thread starter you will see that it was an open question to which InfoHUB people regard as best, whether that be Bear or any other number of InfoHUBS)
But you made sure you told your group members where to post so they could rally. Groit, Nikin, Bluesweet,
Quote:
Maybe if you put as much effort into the social side of SL, instead of using threads like this to promote business, you'll see that there is another side.
Try as we might, greifers make it nearly impossible to enjoy SL to it's fullest - no matter how much time and energy one puts in to create something.
Norf Lundquist
At last something constructive a recommendation to visit
I totally agree about greifers, which is why I hang out at bear where its non scripted and non rez. An Avatar using multiple ID's spoiling enjoyment for people is counter productive in this environment.
Regards
Norf
Bladyblue Bommerang
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
I totally agree about greifers, which is why I hang out at bear where its non scripted and non rez.
But still your group members lured a newbie to a scripted area and shot her.
Quote:
An Avatar using multiple ID's spoiling enjoyment for people is counter productive in this environment.
I am so sorry your 'enjoyment' is spoiled. I was enjoying myself also until this group (Bear Buddies) got together to make this effort to increase traffic in the InfoHub.
Norf
Please - drop it, keep on topic now, your comments have been answered to there fullest, now its just spamming.
Regards
Norf
bladyblue
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
Please - drop it, keep on topic now, your comments have been answered to there fullest, now its just spamming.
You did not consider your group member's you told to post here as spam. Double standard?
Norf
once again you dont get facts correct, just waffling on to get YOUR point across, which to be fair has been disproven on all points - to re-iterate
1) no effort has been made by me or anyone in Bear Buddies to increase traffic to Bear InfoHUB. This threads first post, which you consistantly disregard, does not promote Bear, it was a discussion (non profit!) about InfoHUBS and what other people thought were the BEST
2) we're proud of Bear and like you do with your business, we talk about it (Bear), hence the group (which is open, you still haven't asked to join or made any effort in that department) BUT we dont spam about it and give out LM's to Bear. we also dont charge for information and freely distribute notecards and other items without making the new person spend or feel that they need to repay the favour.
3) accusing us of greifing in a non rez, non script area is proposterous, whilst you say you have had a greifing attack on your premises, well dont tar and accuse people in Bear InfoHUB of that, if its proven then thats a different matter, but unfounded, unproven accusations are contra-constructive. I hope your report to
4) Your hijacking this thread to your own means and to try and discredit a group that are mainly new people wont help your own goals. its spreads distrust towards you even further than the level that you created by standing in Bear shamelessly promoting your business to new people handing out (in the main) unwanted LM's. As you have said here, your business is doing well and have increased from 2 to 4 days a week. I really dont see what the problem is.
5) the 43 people in a sim is not set by anyone but Linden, so please dont direct your tension and frustration against your neighbours - take it up with Linden - SL is a social game with interaction that requires tact, not shooting from the hip making wild accusations because you feel slighted. Take it up with
6) I feel your contributions to this thread have really shown your true colours, whilst I do understand about the "43" rule, if its that much of an issue, maybe a rethink of your business plan and or as mentioned before taking it up with Linden
Regards
Norf
BluesSweet Tomorrow
Other infohubs
I have been to isabel infohub and yes there are all sorts of things to click on but if there is no one there to tell you what your doing,so what is the point of clicking on them? Its a cold unwelcoming hub as i see it. You can build/rezz and do whatever there. No one cares!! In bear we do care. I and many others have passed folders to newbies full of things they will need and teach them how to change skins and put on clothing. We give them landmarks to the freebie shops and some even give out lindens to them. Yes we also dance and have fun. Isn't that what having friends is about? I did not join SL to make money but to get away from RL for a bit after work. This is supposed to be fun. You seem to have forgotten that part of SL. Just as in RL, SL has issues. Will you soon be complaining about the "cars,helicopter,bikes" since we can fly why do we need those here? Im off track of the topic. Bear gets my vote as one of the best places to get to know how to get around SL and to make friends!
Kate Reeve
My choice for the best is. . . . . . Bear
________________________________________
I've been here for almost a year now and can remember those first few weeks so clearly. Oh my gosh what a newbie!! But at Bear there was and is now always a warm welcome and helpful answers. I am not sure I would have stayed without the people from Bear. During the days when Bear was scripted there was SO much more traffic there and griefers (the real griefers). Now that the scripts are no longer active I would say traffic has been cut way down. But no worries, there are still some of us there that are there to answer the newbie’s questions I have made some good friendships on here, and have had some great laughs. Where else can you say you rode on a giant hot dog bus and watch people drop to the ground!! What fun!
I have checked out other info hubs just to see and I was shocked at the differences in people. At Bear we have this understanding and respect for each other and for that I am so grateful.
Kat Reve
OK...Lets get a few facts established in this debate.
1) As already stated, there is no campaign of any sort to get 43 people to attend the infohub. This suggestion is simply untrue and pointless anyway.
2)Accusing the people that frequent the bear Infohub of being "racist" and accusing them of being "griefers" without any foundation whatsoever really just makes you look more than a little paraniod. If there has been any racism by any person (Bear Infohub or otherwise) I would strongly support any action taken against the culprit. If it's any help I recently reported several Racist attacks at the Infohub with photo's and full information.
3) I remember a time a few weeks back when Bladyblue came to the Infohub and asked everybody why they were there. She told us we didnt belong at the Infohub and said that we all needed to "get a job" she then went on to promote her "jobs" to all and sundry including any newbies that happened to appear. So I guess it's ok for some reasons?
4) Leil made it quite clear from the outset that her "shooting people" comment was a tongue in cheek joke. I'm sure she would be happy to clarify this. It's dissapointing that you are using this one line in just about every post. Those that know leil will also know that she does not have a single bit of malice in her.
5) Yep mostly first time posters on the forum........no denying that. Lets take a look at why?..............................OK First someone walks into a friendly community and ask's the people in it why they are there. She then goes on to tell them that they are "chat ghetto people, loiterers, griefers" etc......So, a great way to win friends from the start. She then goes on (over the course of several weeks) to tell these people that she has influence and power with the lindens and that she would take action to get the hub closed if it became a "problem" to her. During this time she has also made accusations of racism towards the people that frequent bear (all totally based on assumption) and one that I for one would welcome to be disproved at the earliest oppertunity. Is it any wonder that people have decided to voice their opinions. In fact it's quite amazing that one person (yes you did this all by your lonesome lias) has managed to stir up enough interest in this thread that so many first time posters have contributed. Well done! Promoting the fact that you are a SL mentor and carry influence with the Lindens to get what you want only serves to annoy people more. I for one am getting tired of the constant "Oh I was talking to so and so Linden today" I am confident that Linden Labs can see through all this paranioa and will not close our hub.
5) The group was originally created to enable us as friends to be able to comunicate with each other more effectively wherever we were. it was also made so that we could share info and have conference voice chat as well as a multitude of other good reasons. It is not an exclusive group and all are welcome. We have extended you an invitation to join which you have so far declined to accept. It is open to newbies as well as mature members as part of a friendly community. Unlike other groups (voodoo especially) we dont spam our members every minute of the day with junk. It is simply there as an aid to our community.
5a) You promote your business as a school which makes it look all very charitable. The fact is you are running a business just the same as thousands of others. The difference here is that you seem to want to control an entire sim just because of the fact that you own some land there.
6) As Blues said above all else SL is about having fun. In your quest to ensure that your business has no rivals or interuptions at any price you have missed the point of this place. It's fun! And as an infohub i see none better than Bear.
Bladyblue Bommerang
And more Bear Buddies pushing Bear Info Hub - Yet the OP does not have any complaints about that - or are they doing as instructed? Nice fake question thread. And it is in the wrong thread.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
now its just spamming.
Yes, I agree. You and your Group members posting over and over again that Bear is the best hub is spamming - and a vieled attempt to fill the hub and make the sim inaccessible to land owners in Bear Sim.
Instead of writing up this false post - in two wrong threads - and subjecting everyone to this nonsense - you all should have just accepted the fact that land owners in a sim YOU DO NOT OWN LAND IN have the right to access their land. This entire effort is ill-concieved and a waste of time. I would expect more from a bunch of people over 30 yeard old.
Norf
Originally Posted by bladyblue Bommerang
And more Bear Buddies pushing Bear Info Hub - Yet the OP does not have any complaints about that - or are they doing as instructed? Nice fake question thread. And it is in the wrong thread.
Yes, I agree. You and your Group members posting over and over again that Bear is the best hub is spamming - and a vieled attempt to fill the hub and make the sim inaccessible to land owners in Bear Sim.
Instead of writing up this false post - in two wrong threads - and subjecting everyone to this nonsense - you all should have just accepted the fact that land owners in a sim YOU DO NOT OWN LAND IN have the right to access their land. This entire effort is ill-concieved and a waste of time. I would expect more from a bunch of people over 30 yeard old.
You really do seem to have major issues about this, I honestly suggest you take it up with
Regards
Norf
bladyblue
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
I request once more to keep on topic, of which you consistantly seem unable to do.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam
OK...Lets get a few facts established in this debate.
OP did not have a problem with the creator of his Bear Buddies group going off-topic. Double standard? Or the grand plan?
Norf
For the 4th time - PLEASE KEEP ON TOPIC -
If you have issues - raise it through the appropriate channels.
bladyblue
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
For the 4th time - PLEASE KEEP ON TOPIC -
If you have issues - raise it through the appropriate channels.
And keep your members on topic also.
Norf
I have no control over "my members" - are you that paranoid that you think I can control people as you obviously think you can ?
SL does not revolve around you - get off your high horse, smell the roses and get a second life
THIS THREAD IS GOING NOWHERE so consider it closed people - nothing to see, lets move on
bladyblue
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
I have no control over "my members" - are you that paranoid that you think I can control people as you obviously think you can ?
SL does not revolve around you - get off your high horse, smell the roses and get a second life
THIS THREAD IS GOING NOWHERE so consider it closed people - nothing to see, lets move on
Since six people - all in the same Bear Buddies group - posted FOR THE FIRST TIME EVER the day you started this thread - Then yes, I know you have control and influence over your group members. Hopefully your group will in time find something more constructive to do than harass land owners in a Sim that you have no investment in.
Norf Lundquist
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 37 Can someone advise how to close a thread please - TY
____________________________________________________________________
Norf Lundquist
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by bladyblue Bommerang
Since six people - all in the same Bear Buddies group - posted FOR THE FIRST TIME EVER the day you started this thread - Then yes, I know you have control and influence over your group members. Hopefully your group will in time find something more constructive to do than harass land owners in a Sim that you have no investment in.
CATAGORICALLY NO-ONE IS HARRASSING YOU BUT THIS IS NOW TANTAMOUNT TO HARASSMENT - PLEASE CLOSE THIS THREAD AND GO PLAY
bladyblue Bommerang
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 597
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
CATAGORICALLY NO-ONE IS HARRASSING YOU BUT THIS IS NOW TANTAMOUNT TO HARASSMENT - PLEASE CLOSE THIS THREAD AND GO PLAY
Welcome to the forums. Try not to use it to play your games anymore and you won't feel harassed.
bladyblue Bommerang
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: NYC
Posts: 597
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norf Lundquist
It now all makes sense... TY for your input and guidance from a long standing member of the community, I'm sure Linden is proud of you - LOL
Linden Lab's goals have advanced over the years - many of us have supported those goals by volunteering for
Standing around in a InfoHub for hours on end, playing pranks and engaging in risque sexual chatter (with the tag 'Bear BITCHES' over their heads) is not a 'community-minded' activity.
Just like gangs - you all came into that area, took it over and insisted you had some stake in it. But you do not. One land owner asked that we try to co-exist and keep the traffic to under 30 in the Hub hanging out and one of you responds by sending out invites for everyone of your group members to have a party in the hub and bring two people each.
If you all really want to help new players (doubtful) Wait until you are 3 months old and then apply for a
Norf Lundquist
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 37 also using 2nd life
Nicki Boucher
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 2 Which info hub do YOU think is best?
________________________________________
Until a few days ago I could only read the forum posts because I had no paid account,
therefore, no posts were made. I replied to a valid question. Other info hubs I've visited
were not as friendly or helpful as the people at Bear. The no script, no rezz features
have kept griefing down in the area as well. Travis, those are the only suggestion I
could make regarding your info hub. I've thoroughly enjoyed the friendships I've made
at Bear, some have been quite long lasting. People come to have a "second life". Some
have businesses, others come to meet friends, chat, shop, and play. I don't think this
thread should be closed because others are now coming to reply to a valid question.
Groit Straaf
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 3 buy some alcohol and get over it
________________________________________
Noone told me to reply.. oh yeah go read 5.5 in the TOS. I think it says that you are entitled to $50 if anything.. that is IF the numbers grow to 43.
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Last edited by Groit Straaf : 09-18-2007 at 05:23 PM.
Strife Onizuka
Resident Moderator
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: !quit !quit !quit !quit
Posts: 4,921 Action: Lock & LR
Source: AR
Reasons: Off-Topic for this forum & Harassment reported
__________________
[indent]Truth is a river that is always splitting up into arms that reunite. Islanded between the arms, the inhabitants argue for a lifetime as to which is the main river.
- Cyril Connolly
Without the political will to find common ground, the continual friction of tactic and counter tactic, only creates suspicion and hatred and vengeance, and perpetuates the cycle of violence.
- James Nachtwey[/indent]
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Last edited by Torley Linden : 09-19-2007 at 04:03 PM. Reason: Sad to see this got ugly; this thread remains closed, please read our Guidelines @ http://forums.secondlife.com/faq.php?
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